posted by Sam Richards
Watch this video and read the text. And while you’re doing so, think about two things:
1. For those of you who think you “know” when someone is LGBT…would you ever think that Darren Manzella is gay?
2. A recent report from military officials investigating whether having LGBT soldiers on a unit “weakens morale” decidedly determined that it does not and that the DADT policy should be abandoned.
In regards to the questions that Sam posted, I do not think that just by looking or hearing Darren talk I was able to tell that he was gay. But really- does that really matter?! I mean the way people carry themselves in reflective of their personality. There are plenty of gay people who act flamboyant but there are plenty who do not. People have come up with this idea that any man who acts “girly”, dresses really well, or anything along those lines must be and maybe that is the case sometimes but just because a man doesn’t go around wearing tight clothes, fake tanning, or whatever doesn’t mean that he’s necessarily straight. People are just going to act/ dress however they feel comfortable not to fit into these pre-conceived stereotypes. The same goes for lesbians, typically people would consider lesbians to be very butch, into sports, short hair but what about lipstick lesbians?
I think that the whole don’t ask don’t tell policy in the army is a definite form of discrimination. Straight people are free to talk about their significant other, write letters to them, and keep their pictures close. Gay people in the army pretty much have to go their entire deployment acting as if there’s no one at home who loves them or is waiting for them. I mean Sam is always talking about this wave, this LGBT wave that is taking over so we have to ready for change. How are people expected to change when people who are not straight are deemed incapable of defending our country? I mean you would think that with some government allowing unions between same sex couples, there would be more government support for people. These people are not missing some certain gene that is necessary to be in the army, I mean really. People look up to the government, we learn by example and we respect things that are or seem to be greater than us as individuals. So what is it saying to believe if people can’t even come out and still be able to serve their country- I feel like that’s setting a pretty shitty example.
The don’t ask don’t tell policy has no place in the army. Who really cares if someone is gay? This reminds me of the movie, Prayers for Bobby. In the movie Bobby cannot come out to his family and when he finally does he mom tries to cure him- like being gay was some type disease. Bobby ends up killing himself because he can’t just be who he is. I think that being gay or straight doesn’t affect the way you act as a person or affect the type of solider you would make. I do, however, think that it does help to keep a person going. Sexuality is a part of people, people want to find love and it’s not fair to ask someone to repress feelings because it’s anything but straight. In my opinion there’s no right or wrong when it comes to sexuality.
Prior to reading this blog, I was completely unaware of the fact that people could be discharged from the army for being homosexual. This is extremely disappointing to me. It also really irritates me because discharging an individual from the army based on that individual’s sexual orientation makes no sense at all. My cousin is in the army, and he has a girlfriend who is in the army as well. Neither of them was discharged because they were in a loving relationship so I do not see why any other individual in the army could logically be discharged because of who he or she is in a relationship with. I am very disappointed in my country. Denying people the right to help defend their country just because they are homosexual is completely racist. I thought our country was supposed to treat everyone as equals. This issue is certainly not upholding that value in any way. It is simply depriving people of their rights as American citizens.
The fact that research proves that having LGBT soldiers in a unit does not weaken morale shows just how ridiculous the DADT policy is. I could never see how having a homosexual person in a unit could weaken morale in any way. To me, any extra person, whether they were homosexual or not, would be a welcome addition to my unit. The more support I could get in fighting a war the better.
I have nothing but the utmost respect for anyone who is willing to risk his or her life for the sake of our country. I know that being in the army is certainly not something I would want to have to do. For that reason, I think we should all be thankful for anyone who is willing to join the armed forces in order to protect our country. No matter what the sexual orientation of an individual, he or she must definitely be a brave individual if he or she is going to become a soldier. All soldiers have to go through basic training in order to be qualified as soldiers so if a person passes the basic training test but is homosexual, there should really not be an issue since that person obviously has the same ability as everyone else that has passed the test.
This blog opened my eyes to yet another injustice that is a part of our society. It is truly a shame that we cannot be more accepting of others. We are only hurting our country by preventing homosexuals from being in the army. It is just crazy how discriminatory people can be towards those who are different. Hopefully one day, we will all be able to see past our differences and this will not be an issue any more.
Unlike race, sexuality is not something you can tell just by looking at someone. There are some gay guys who are obviously gay. When I say obviously gay, I mean they’re wearing the tight pants, tight shirt, they’re very well kept, and talk the way we assume all gay guys should talk. But as always, there is the exception. Darren Manzella is the exception. If I was talking down the street and saw him, I would not guess he was gay. Darren Manzella was even able to “fool” the military for a while.
The main issue here is not whether or not you can tell if someone is LGBT, but rather having LGBT soldiers on a unit “weakens morale”. Without even watching the video I can tell you that this is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. If you’re in battle and there’s a soldier fighting next to you, why would it matter if he’s gay? As long as he’s on your side and doing all the right things, his sexuality shouldn’t matter. I think having “Debbie downers” would weaken morale more than a gay person would. I don’t think it’s fair to turn away a person because he/she is LGBT. If they want to fight and defend our country then let them. This is discrimination against LGBT people. Let’s say it was turned around and instead of not allowing LGBT people join the military, we didn’t let black people join. All hell would break loose because it’s racist.
What is the military so worried about? In class Sam mentioned a few times that he’s been involved with the gay community and has only ever been hit on by a guy once in his lifetime. And girls are allowed in the military so being hit on can’t be the issue. Maybe it’s the stereotype that gay guys are weak and can’t defend themselves. But that can’t be the issue either because Darren Manzella wanted to join and wanted to fight. So basically the United States Military does not have a good reason to discriminate against LGBT people. Maybe in the past the DADT policy was a good idea, but times are changing and LGBT people are becoming more and more accepted into society. It’s about time the military got rid of the policy.
Darren Manzella mentioned that 13,000 people have been discharged since DADT was enacted in 1993. What I don’t understand is why the military would draft people who obviously don’t want to fight, and discharge 13,000 LGBT soldiers who do want to fight. The military is the most diverse group Darren Manzella has ever encountered and if any group can adapt to change it’s the military. So far, they’re not going a good job showing they can adapt.
After listening to the story about Darren Manzella being gay and because of it eventually being discharged it blows my mind. First off aster listening to the story I would have never of guess that Darren Manzella was in fact gay. He showed no signs as well as being pretty open with the idea of being gay. I give him a great deal of respect for being able to come out and say that he was gay and not caring what people in the military thought. As of right now he is traveling around stressing the idea of living as the person you are rather than hiding your real identity because life is too short to no be yourself. The idea of don’t ask don’t tell is basically saying that if you are gay do not tell others and to keep it to yourself. I think that idea is bullshit I believe that if you are gay you should not have to hide it. The fact that the military is very diverse but yet they are still uncomfortable with the idea of being gay is almost them being a hypocrite. I don’t believe that their idea of don’t as don’t tell mentality will last very long because of the extreme number of gays and lesbians who are in the military and who are quite frankly tired of hiding their true identity. After Darren Manzella was discharged the military said the reason was because he was gay. In my eyes that not only prejudice but that’s so wrong because I an guarantee everyone in the military knows or is family/ friends with some one who is gay or lesbian so how can they possibly be such hypocrites to pass judgment on someone that defends our country when they are no different from that person that you know. I give him all the credit in the world for being able to come out as well as being a voice for all those in the military to be able to come out and then be supported by others as well as the gay community. I think that the government should meet with the military services and discuss something that will solve this situation because clearly it isn’t something that is okay with a lot of people. I believe that this situation has opened up many peoples eyes and made them realize that something must be done because it is not illegal to be gay or lesbian so why is it that you cannot speak of it in the military. All in all I give Darren Manzella a world of credit because most people abide by the rule of don’t ask don’t tell and Darren Manzella refused to do that, he took the punishment but he is not unhappy about his decision the least bit.
Like many times before I have said someone should be who they want to be and not have to hide it for certain people especially the United States Army. The fact that you as an LGBT cannot be open with your own country is absurd. I feel like the don’t ask don’t tell policy is very discriminatory. I feel like anyone that is willing to fight for our country when it is in need should be allowed to. If you pass the requirements needed and are physically capable for joining the army or any armed force for our government then it is pure discrimination if you can if you are LGBT. This topic always gets me fired up because I do have many close gay and lesbian friends, and they are some of the best friends and people I have ever known. It would be different if someone was discharged because they were acting inappropriately or out of conduct and then were found to be LGBT. But the simple fact that you are “honorably discharged” for the simple fact of your sexual orientation is ludicrous and angers me.
When Sam asked us if we could tell that Sergeant Manzella was gay or not I would one hundred percent say just by watching the video and hearing him speak, no way! I feel like even a gay man might not even know until he got to know him. Not every gay man is a flamboyant one, and I think that is the stereotype that a lot of gay men get nowadays. The fact that after Manzella came out about being gay and it boosting the morale of his unit has to tell us something. Maybe it’s the simple fact that the people who came up with this absurd “don’t ask don’t tell law” should look on the mirror and see pure ignorance. For someone to be denied to want to risk their life for the country is one thing, but for an LGBT who knows there are already discriminations and stereotypes out there for them, to want to risk there like for their country yes should be honored but not honorably discharged in anyway shape or form. It is just ridiculous to see how different some people can get treated.
I strongly feel that anyone should be able to be “the real me” and not have to hide the true person they are. Overall I commend Manzella and any other men and women who have been discharged for the sexual orientation. I hope one day the government realizes how ignorant they are when it comes to serving our country.
Don’t ask don’t tell policy is in my opinion a very discriminatory act, and only causes more issues. The sexual orientation of a person doesn’t change their effectiveness in battle or their ability to meet the mental and physical demands of the army, and as recent studies have shown, the sexual orientation of a soldier doesn’t have an effect on the morale of their comrades. This act should be dismissed and if a person meets the physical requirements and is capable of being a soldier, they should be allowed to enlist and stay enlisted.
As I said before, the sexual orientation of a soldier doesn’t change their physical and mental abilities. They are able to perform the same in the eyes of their comrades and officers whether they are a known LGBT soldier or not. The army calls its soldiers to, “be all that you can be” and being LGBT does not hinder someone from being all they can be. What does hinder an LGBT soldier from being all they can be is the LGBT act. With this they need to hide things and lead a secret life, they are always going to be held back among their “family”. Being LGBT also doesn’t hinder a soldier from being mentally or emotionally fit for the army and combat. The proof of this is in the statistic that according to the article, there are currently 65,000 gays, lesbians, and bisexuals currently in the military. Just because the military and other’s don’t know the sexual orientation of these 65,000 soldiers, the soldiers still have the same mind and body as they would if people knew. They are getting the job done now, so why wouldn’t they be able to if they could be open about their orientation?
So all the act really is protecting or concerned about is the morale of the other soldiers. The army, of all people should know that the times are changing and should be adapting with them. We aren’t in the 70’s 80’s and 90’s anymore. It is more homosexuality is more commonly accepted and practiced now. With the newer outlook, and the results from the study showing that homosexuals have no effect on the morale of the soldiers and units there is no reason for the DADT policy. The Army is always looking, “for a few good men” what’s the difference if those few men are gay? They are still good men nonetheless.
All in all, my feelings towards the “don’t ask, don’t tell policy” are simple. It is unnecessary, and discriminatory. If these men and women are willing to put their life on the line for their country, the least our country could do in return is accept them for who they are. They are able body soldiers, and their sexual orientation has no overall negative effect on the army. If they want to fight, let them fight.
This story makes me really angry. I am not very familiar with military happenings and terms so I did not know about this “don’t ask don’t tell” rule. After we talked about it in class on our LGBT day that was the first time I heard the phrase. I watched the video of Darren and if I didn’t know any better I would not have guessed that he was gay. Unlike some people that you meet that it is very obvious they are gay or lesbian, he seemed straight to me. Maybe this is the way he had to condition himself all those years he was in the army and had to keep his true identity hidden for fear of ridicule and expulsion. Darren seems like such a sincere and normal guy, who just wanted to fight for his country. Why his sexuality has anything to do with his ability to protect his country is beyond me. If I were gay, lesbian, or bisexual, quite frankly I would not want to be a member of the military. Why would I risk my life in an organization putting myself in danger every day for a country that doesn’t respect me and give me the rights that I deserved? That makes no sense. The fact that such a rule as don’t ask don’t tell even exists in the army seems ridiculous to me. They are experiencing a shortage of willing soldiers these days. So why would they turn people away by discouraging them from joining because of their sexuality or discharging valuable and hard working people who are already members? What happened to Darren seems so unfair to me. Especially considering the poll results that Sam posted on the original blog that the knowledge of a LGBT person on a squad does not weaken morale or effect the unit in a negative way, I think this is a true indicator that don’t ask don’t tell should be abolished. As they mentioned in the article from CNN, the military is one of the most forward thinking and minority filled employment organization and it should be able to adapt to and recognize this issue. Most major organizations today have laws and codes that call for no discrimination on the basis of sexuality. Why doesn’t this apply to the military as well? One of the largest employers in the country. I think that it’s pretty sneaky that after he brought his sexuality up to his supervisor and nothing happened to him after the investigation, that he was later discharged once he thought he was going to be off the hook. I think that despite the unfair treatment and alienation that he experienced, I think that it’s great Darren is using his story to help others.
The policy of “don’t ask, don’t tell” seems to be a policy that is pretty quickly becoming unnecessary. When the policy was enacted in 1993 it may have been a necessary thing for the army to do. Times have changed though and almost seventeen years later it seems like the taboos against homosexual relationships have become less severe and are not what they once were. The polls that have been taken recently seem to show that the people that are members of the armed forces would not feel any different if they knew that the men that they were serving alongside were gay. This is a big change most likely from what those same polls would have been if they had been taken back in 1993 when this policy was enacted. Although the people that were in the army at the time could have felt the same as they do now. It seems that the men that serve together in the army though share a bond that people that have never served in the army just will not ever fully understand. If you are willing to put your life on the line for the person that is standing next to you then I see no reason why you should not be given the opportunity to do it. If there is an American citizen that is able bodied and wants to go out and serve his or her country then there should be no reason that they are not allowed to go out and protect their country.
One of the statements made by Darren Manzella really did stand out to me the most though as to why the “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy could be repealed and it would not be much of a deal to the armed forces personal. The fact is that he said that the members of the army and trained to be people who simply follow the orders of their superiors. So if the superiors were to say to them that these was going to happen then they would be willing to let go of their personal beliefs and go along with the orders that they had been given. That is what they have been trained for since the day they signed up for the army and entered their first day of boot camp. This was the point that seemed to make the most sense to me out of everything that was said. The other question that was raised was to see if you would think that Darren was gay. If I did not know that he was going in to seeing this video I would never have been able to figure out that he was gay. He just seemed like a soldier and that was all I took him for. Which added to why I thought that “don’t ask, don’t tell” is something that is not necessary.
After seeing this Video about the “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” I was very surprised I can't believe the military would think so wrong about gay guys. In my opinion I don’t see how being gay would be a problem in fighting in the military? Does the military think a gay guy is weaker than a straight guy or do they actually think being gay is some kind of contagious disease? I really don’t see a reason why the military would discriminate against gay guys if they are only there to fight. I think they have no right to ask or get involved with the personal life of any solider there. In reality being a solider is like any other job in the United States, you don’t have your boss asking you are you gay or lesbian or any question that has to do with your personal life. This is a complete discriminating act against soldiers, I think it is ridicules that the few soldiers that we have are getting fired because of stupid reason like these. If these guys are willing to fight for our country I see no problem with them being guy and fighting. Because war is war, nobody is going to be asking you if you are gay before they shot at you, I mean being gay has nothing wrong with it. You would expect that living in the 21st century more people would be acceptable of these kinds of situations, now that it is so common to be gay or lesbian. I think the military is being hypocritical because the United States is suppose to be a very country of freedom, meaning everyone has the freedom of expressing their thoughts and feelings. But with situations like these, its causing people to start lying and doing things they are not suppose to just to stay in, for example in the military. In my opinion I think the military should just start getting use to the fact that they are going to have to allow gay guys in the military sooner or later. They should start doing this because sooner or later society is going to become more acceptable and actions like these will defiantly be banned or made illegal by the government. Because like I mentioned this is complete racism, it would be like denying a colored person the opportunity to fight just because he was black. In reality I think if the men are capable of fighting and they meet all the requirements, they should be denied the opportunity because of color, race or just because they are gay. I don’t see the connection with being able to fight or not being able to fight just because a man I gay. I think the military show reform this rule because the United States is in a need of soldiers and this is definably making this situation worse!
I think many people don’t see how wrong the “Don’t as don’t tell” policy is. At first it seems like a good idea to avoid drama but, what man wants to lie to himself and other people. He is working with these other men to fight for our country. It is supposed to be about honesty, unity and hope to come together to protect the people they love at home and the rest of the United States. What it comes down to is that we need people to step up and fight for peace in the world. Why would you judge and discriminate against someone and hope for peace and an end with war. It shouldn’t matter if the person is gay, bisexual or straight. They’re all men who care and offer their lives in the place for someone else’s life and happiness. I think “Don’t ask don’t tell” is the same thing as racism and other forms of discrimination. To me, racism and discrimination is hate and prejudice against someone else that does not necessarily involve taking physical action. It can be a silent hatred as well. It isn’t going to go away either. These men who are forced to hide their lifestyle but how they feel about their sexual preference is not going to disappear and just not exist anymore. They will continue to be LGBT until they are either accepted or at home, if they make it home alive.
Another thing that bothers me about “Don’t ask don’t tell” is that the men who are LGBT are at times forced to be scared of their sexuality and the truth behind it. Personally, I rather have someone who is comfortable with their sexuality fighting for my life without fear. I don’t want a man enlisted to be more scared of another man than the war itself. Or, just as scared of the war. With a man who is LGBT and enlisted to fight in the war, shows bravery in itself. He is a man who is willing to put everything aside and see what is really important, and be selfless.
Overall, I think the video Darren is in is very inspiring to LGBT men who are interested in going into the ROTC. He tells the truth and does not fabricate a bit of what his experience when he was in combat. I think it is a great way to let other men know that if he is brave enough to do it, they can too. I would have never assumed he was gay until he came right out and said it. He is a huge man and has a lot to contribute to our country. In my opinion, he is a great soldier and other LGBT should be inspired by his story.
The blog entitled “Don't Ask, Don't Tell…please” showed the ridiculous nature of the policy, but also made me have more respect for the military when it comes to homosexuals in the Army. Most people see the military as a place that needs absolute perfect teamwork. Any kind of divide or barrier between getting along will make a unit weaker and endanger the soldiers and weaken the nation's defense. This was the thinking behind the segregation of the Army between blacks and whites decades ago. Obviously, this is a absolutely false. If anything, the military serves as a place to look past all of those bogus societal divides. After all, when one is depending on another for survival, color or creed goes out the window. The same goes for women in the service. They go through the same regimen and the same boot camp to make it into the Army. If the military is able to ensure men and women can work together overseas without any sexual distraction, then there is absolutely no reason that homosexuals should be barred from serving. In fact, the military should be thankful that a homosexual would volunteer to fight for a country that denies him or her the same rights it provides for straight men and women.
Darren Manzella served the country twice, once while being totally out, and provided what many called exemplary service. The Army rewarded him by discharging him for being himself. Manzella himself said that the Army is one of the most diverse places he has ever been. This is actually a very true statement. My friend served in Iraq and was around soldiers from the city, from the country, from the south, from the north, soldiers who were white, black, Asian and Spanish. There are very few institutions in which you can experience such diversity. Just as my friend quickly adapted to this diversity and embraced his fellow soldiers, so did the men and women that fought beside Manzella. He was able to have pictures of his boyfriend out and make phone calls to his significant other without anyone caring at all. This makes me believe Manzella when he said that eventually the Army will allow gays to serve because the Army adapts to diversity much faster than the rest of the population. The Army is merely enforcing a law that has been in place for over a decade and a half. Once they realize it is a law that is preventing accomplished and “critical” members of the military from serving, they will abolish it and the Army will not be hurt at all. I just feel that if anyone wants to serve and protect their country, they should be allowed to do so. It is the most patriotic thing you can do and it is something that should be respected without any attention given to their sexual orientation.
After reading a little and then watching the video clip I was left speechless. I always knew about the whole “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell Policy” in the military but I guess I never realized how serious this policy really was. As we all know, in the past and well present. The army has done a lot of things that the general public doesn’t exactly agree with, but they still do it regardless. They have done things from being in warring countries for way to long, to killing many harmless civilians, and so much more. However, to me the way they treat Lesbian, Gay, Bi, and Transgender individuals is definitely up there. I don’t understand why they feel the need to discharge these individuals just because of their sexual orientation. It truly makes no sense. These individuals have to keep their love lives secrets at all times just so they won’t be investigated and possibly discharged if they are found to be homosexual. When you are in the army, they do their best to train you to basically be all that you can be. In reality they are training you to never give up. My thing is, regardless of their sexual orientation, these individuals are still able to do the things that heterosexual individuals can do. I highly doubt that anyone would join the army if they felt that they were not up for it. Just because they are Lesbian, Gay, Bi, or Transgender doesn’t mean they are weaker or less than heterosexual individuals. It has made me see, that just like many other individuals in the world today the army is homophobic and does not want anything other than heterosexual individuals in the army etc. I guess they just don’t like the idea of homosexuals helping to defend our country.
This article has really made me think and has opened my eyes. As I said earlier we all need to realize that just because someone is homosexual it doesn’t mean that they are less capable of doing what heterosexual individuals can do. In the end we are truly all the same, so why not be treated the same? These soldiers who are helping to defend our country usually love what they do and do it for a reason, so why take that away from them?
I don’t get what the problem is. We as a society have grown to accept other races, religion, etc. but why have we not yet learned to accept Lesbian, Gay, Bi, and Transgender individuals in the army? Not even just that, I don’t understand why we still shun homosexual individuals. Why can’t we just accept them to? Why can we all just learn to accept each other? I guess you could say that these are just age old questions that are still waiting to be answered.
Although I find this to be very unfortunate, I think that a little too much blame is put on the military. The last paragraph of the AP article pretty much sums it up. "The policy is not a military policy, and the Army has a policy because it is bound by current statute. If the law were potentially to change, the Army would change to enforce whatever the law may be." If the law was not there, I truly believe that the military would not have a problem with gays, bisexuals, or the transgender. As for this story, it is quite sad. I think what makes it worse is that it was dragged out for so long. Manzella was pretty much given false hope after coming out to his supervisor and not receiving any punishment for it. It took about 2 years to for him to hear from the military that he was being honorably discharged. The positive side is that Manzella mentioned that him coming out did not affect his unit negatively. In fact, he said that it ironically pulled them together. It is this kind of behavior that will help someday eliminate the “don’t ask, don’t tell” law. This is just evidence that homosexuals do not affect the morale of the troops, or compromise any missions in some way, or do whatever action that first brought forth such a law. Someday it will be gone and I see it happening in the near future because of the change of personalities. People have become more comfortable with their own sexuality and also have become more comfortable with the sexuality of other people. It is also evident, as mentioned by the article, that the “don’t ask, don’t tell” law is causing the military to be very inefficient. If it takes 200 million dollars to replace the 800 “critically” skilled militants that have been discharged based on their sexual preference then I can see the military eventually running out of money – and complaining about it. Unfortunately, it is the law and the military has to abide, but it is obviously causing the nation a whole lot of money. So what is the point of even keeping it around anymore?
Would I think that Manzella is gay? I guess I would have to meet him first, but if I just saw him on the street I would not think he was gay. I have friends that are gay that I had no idea were the first time I met them. It was not until other friends told me they were. Either way, the DADT law is ridiculous. It should be rid of, and hopefully it will be soon. Because if there are people out there who are willing to defend our country and lay their lives on the line but they happen to be homosexual, we should not stop them from doing so.
Don’t ask don’t tell was a way of publically dealing with an issue that needed to be dealt with at the time, but was a really shitty band aid that ended up backfiring. LGBT people in the military should be a non-issue, but people will always make a fuss over people that are different than what they define as ‘normal. The military is representative of the entire US, so it should be open to open members from all groups.
I never would have guessed that Darren Manzella was gay. He is nothing that the stereotypes say gay men look like. Has anyone ever seen G.I. Jane? GREAT movie. In it, eventhough she was married to a high ranking officer, she was accused of lesbian activities and consequently got kicked out of the Navy SEALs program. (She was the first woman accepted into the Navy SEAL program, and understandably there was considerable backlash). Since it is a movie, there was an appeal and she was allowed to return, and it ends happily. I read somewhere while researching a project for a feminism class that Don’t ask don’t tell was used by sexist people to discharge females more often than gay men. This may be because more lesbians enlist than gay men, but I’m not sure that I agree. I think that the numbers can’t be that far apart.
I can’t imagine what it’d be like to live parts of your life being careful how you do everything to disguise who you are. I suppose that most people interact with different people differently, I know I do, but to do that out of fear would be nerve wracking and stressful. I have to imagine that talk of those you left behind have to be pretty common during time off, pictures and such. That would be an unnecessary added stressor to an already stressful job.
Sex is another way of connecting with people…a connection that has a lot of emotion behind it, so it is understandable that this is such a charged issue. I truly despise people that actively seek people out because they are different, to put them down. Why do people hate? Why are people so angry? I’ve come to the conclusion that there is not much I can do. All I can do is be nice to the people around me and discount the people who are mean to me.
There is a fantastic show called West Wing that ended a couple of years ago about the President and his staff (housed in the west wing of the white house, and so named). In one of the episodes there is a meeting between the deputy communications director and a couple high ranking officers to discuss Don’t ask Don’t tell. The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs walked in (he was black) and made a statement equating LGBT inequality in the military to the Black struggle for equality in the military. Pretty Cool.
The U.S. military is one of the, if not the, most powerful forces in the world today. Americans of all backgrounds join the military to fight for the freedoms we have. Even Darren Manzella mentioned in this video that the military is one of the most diverse groups he has ever encountered. Yet, the Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell policy is still in effect. I have been called by recruiters trying to get me to join the military, and I have heard of many others who have been called. It seems as though they will take anyone because they will find some use for that individual. So why is it that they are willing to recruit 18-year-olds right out of high school, but they are not willing to keep Darren Manzella, a man who is helping to preserve the freedoms many of us take for granted in Iraq, and who also happens to be gay? This is hypocrisy at its finest. He obeys orders, he follows his leaders, and he fights for his country. He is not risking the lives of his fellow soldiers and he is no less competent because of his sexual orientation. I am thankful for having soldiers that are willing to risk their lives for the betterment of my own- black, white, straight, gay, man or woman. I see no problem in having somebody join the military as long as they follow orders as Darren Manzella has done. I “knew” that some of my friends were gay before they came out of the closet, and others, it came as a surprise. I would never expect Darren Manzella to be gay if I had just met him. That is what makes this story so strange and hypocritical. The soldiers around him that didn’t know he was gay probably treated him no differently after finding out. And why should they? It’s just the DADT policy that got him discharged. It seems as though this sort of discrimination is just another cycle in the history of diverse acceptance. People of color were not allowed in the military; women were not allowed in the military; maybe the military will soon see that sexual orientation has no effect on a person’s values, strength, or courage. Taken from the video, about 65,000 troops in the military are homosexual, and 13,000 troops have been discharged because of it. That’s 13,000 Americans that could be and should be allowed to fight for our country, but are dismissed. I just don’t see why the military is constantly looking to recruit anyone, so long as they are not gay. I think that Darren Manzella is a brave and patriotic man who simply wants to fight for his country, and the fact that he is gay has no impact on his time in war.
I do not really understand what the problem is if someone is gay or lesbian or bisexual or just confused or what ever they are. Why cant they be in the army or and sort of military organization. What since they are gay they can't fight for their country and not just their country but for YOU, the people who are saying that they can not be in it. Why make someone live their lives a secret and not be able to come out and say who they really are, what are you people, homophobes? Because they probably wouldn't even be attracted to the people who are against this anyway. Why does it matter who they attracted too anyway because when you are in the military they put medicine in your food anyway to take your horny-ness away. For some people I think that being gay or lesbian or whatever is a choice and that is who they want to be and feel comfortable with it but sometimes I feel that some people may be born with it and cant help that that is who they are, especially when people at such a young age determine that they are gay. It should not matter if they are white, black, Asian, gay, straight, lesbian, bisexual, blue or green, if they are willing to sacrifice their lives for others and too keep us safe and free from harm and make this world a better place then who has the right to say that they can not. So if there was a draft, are you not going to draft a gay person? Or what about if you were in the army right now would you not look out for your gay comrade like you would your straight comrade? because if you didn't then you are a coward and should not be in the military yourself. I thought we had freedom in this country? Freedom of speech, freedom of choice, choose who we want to be and be able to talk about it, then why can't people in the military who are gay come out and say that they are or they will be discharged. So be it, if I was in the military I would want gay people side by side fighting for me and for others because they are the strongest ones to say who they are against the criticism of others and they have the courage to stand their and be strong. I think that they need to change the rule right now and allow gay people to be able to fight for our country and for our freedom and keep this country safe. This is the country of freedom right? or wrong?
I think first of all, the biggest thing that comes to my mind when I see something like this is that, people need to remember, homosexuality doesn’t make you any different of a human being than heterosexuality. Personally, for me it is just not an issue what someone’s sexual preferences are. This guy served his country proudly, even after being “honorably” discharged he spoke well about the army and its ability to adapt and he seemed optimistic about its future with this controversial “don’t ask, don’t tell” issue. There was nothing other than his own admitting he was gay that brought it to my knowledge that he was indeed gay. This tells me all I need to know about the issue. He is Darren Manzella, a guy who was a soldier and is probably normal to every degree of life. So why does his sexuality have to be such a big deal? If he was into girls it wouldn’t even come to mind at all. All that I would focus on is that he is a soldier that is the only interesting thing about the guy in my opinion. Why should I care who he likes to get intimate with? It’s none of my business and if we hung out that’s probably not something that we would talk about anyways.
The whole issue about LGBT is more of a waste of human energy then the issue of race. I think all intolerance is crap and such a flaw in the human fabric, but the sexuality issues in particular are the worse. This is an issue that is about a private intimate act. I don’t expect someone to tell me how my girlfriend and I can behave if we truly love each other and do whatever it is that we do, that is OUR business. So why should I expect homosexuals to bow to the opinions of heterosexuals? Why can’t they do what makes them happy and be with who they want to be with? It doesn’t stop my relationships it doesn’t affect anyone other then the people who probably are having their own insecurities and can’t deal with them. Its just senseless hatred and negativity. I’m supposed to look down on someone because their happy and in love with someone of their own gender, why? Why do I have to waste the time in doing that? Why can’t I just wish them the best in their lives and move on minding my own business and enjoy my own life. Doesn’t anyone else get that its easier to live your life without worrying about getting people down. It’s so lame and I can only hope for a day where its just done and people can just back off and let people live and be happy.
The “Don’t ask, don’t tell” policy being enacted in 1993 is a testament to the conservative nature of the military. It was then, and is now, clear that there are gays who serve in the various divisions of our armed forces, and that the military recognized they needed the contributions of these individuals. Rather than changing its policy against homosexuality, a more conservative route was chosen that opted for required ignorance over a fairness exemplary of the rights built into our government.
Why should gays not be allowed to defend their country? It is the same argument made against blacks serving during World War II. Those individuals wanted to defend their country but were originally prohibited from doing so. They were eventually allowed to serve, despite being put in segregated units. Banning someone from the armed services on the grounds of their race, gender, ethnicity, religion, or sexual orientation goes against everything our country was built on. There isn’t a job you can apply for that doesn’t include a statement on the application about how that company or employer does not discriminate against any of the above characteristics. Why should being in the military be any different? That is a job, voluntarily chosen, just like any other. One for which you have to be qualified to perform, meet the physical requirements to complete necessary tasks, and that you are trained to complete. If you were to follow this code of action, banning gays from serving solely because of their sexuality, you might as well ban blacks, Hispanics, Indians, women, muslims, Jews, pacific islanders, and anyone else who does not fit the mold of the “all-American white male”. They have every right to defend their country, fight for their freedoms, and serve as any other individual who calls America their home.
Most people who oppose gays serving in the military do so because they believe it will hurt unit morale and troop cohesion. However studies have proved that no such effect would occur. Any troubles resulting from someone’s sexuality are no different than any other issues that are currently dealt with and handled. There are always going to be people with differences in opinion who don’t get along. And that would be no different with homosexual individuals. As Darren Manzella showed, he served for fifteen months in Iraq with his unit while being openly gay, and it wasn’t a problem.
Banning gays clearly doesn’t keep them from joining. Removing this policy wouldn’t create a surge of homosexual recruits either, which undoubtedly worries some politicians. Joining the armed services is a serious decision, one that few individuals are willing to make. Anyone with a desire to serve will do all that they can to do so, even if the law tells them they are not wanted. No one should be banned from defending their country.
In response to the article posted, “Don’t ask don’t tell…Please,” I completely agree with all of those who disagree with the Don’t Ask Don’t Tell policy. If studies have shown that a soldier being gay takes nothing away from the morale of a unit then the issue of whether there are gay individuals in the unit should not be of any concern in my opinion. What is shocking to me is that when someone finds out that another person is gay; other people automatically think that that person is going to make sexual advances towards them and that is completely out of line especially when serving in the military when any gay person knows of the repercussions involved with doing so. Everyone in the military is there for a common purpose, to protect and serve their own country. But as the policy implies, if a person of homosexual or bisexual orientation does not display or disclose anything about their relationship and enters the military, they have not violated the law. In the case of Darren Manzella, for a while he received the treatment of a gay person that should be received while serving in the military. Even after it had been found out that he was a homosexual, he was allowed to serve for a time, while being openly gay and that no one had had any recollection and there had been no instances which have proved him to actually be gay and thus being one instance where the empirical evidence has shown that having members of the homosexual community in a military unit has no negative effects on the morale of the unit. The biggest thing surrounding whether the Don’t Ask Don’t Tell act should be repealed or not should be everyone involved in the committee considering the state of the country as a whole when examining how everyone stands on the LGBT issue. Compared to 1993 when the act was passed, the country, in general, has grown much more accepting to people who are openly homosexual or bisexual. When the Don’t Ask Don’t Tell act was passed the country as a whole was not on the same level of acceptance/tolerance that it is now, so at the time the act might have been fitting and acceptable but for today’s time and place, the act is reaching obsolescence. As my final thoughts, I feel that any person regardless of sexual orientation should be allowed to serve his or her own country if he or she chooses to do so; however, just by being homosexual or bisexual should not be a reason to discharge someone from their duties in the military. If there is an actual instance of that person advancing on another then the issue should be handled in the appropriate manner; however, if not there should be no boundaries.
When I first read the prompts to think about before watching the video, I knew it was going to be a tough case to agree with. The plain old fact is that we never truly know what other people’s sexual orientation is, let alone basic things about their lives. One of my best guy friends acts in the most “gay” ways possible. (I do not mean this in any kind of a derogatory sense.) He is very concerned with his dress, loves musicals, speaks with his hands and has a very high-pitched voice. He has no male friends, and always wonders why he can’t get a real girlfriend. Is he gay? Who knows, we can all make our outside assumptions but the only one who really knows is him; and until he is ready to share that or choose not to, is totally in his hands.
Now onto the issue of this young man’s. When should sexual orientation ever take precedence in the work world? Never. Never should someone’s preference of significant others determine their job, placement or pay. I think this whole “Don’t Ask Don’t Tell” policy is a front of denial with the US Military. I think they have two options, either do not allow gays to enlist (however this is a stupid choice) or do not care whatsoever what a person’s sexual orientation is. Ironic that until the case went public nothing was done. I am not here to criticize the military, I give them massive credit for the things they do and the people who compromise them. But I see a problem when they will acknowledge some cases white not others. This young man was an excellent person and army man regardless of his decisions outside of work. In many other professions, if they discriminated based on sexual orientation they would be taken to court and often would lose; but when it comes to the US Military, they are allowed to discriminate. These men and women are volunteering their lives to protect us, and we are about to discriminate them? What kind of a democracy are we if people can’t even stand up for our own country. I mean if we for some reason had to bring back the draft, would LBGTs be dismissed because of their sexual orientation? Heck, I think in that situation you would find a drastic change in numbers. But realistically, that is not a reason people could be excused from the draft, so why does it matter if people are volunteering. One of the things that organizations struggle with, is the lack of power in choosing their volunteers: but when able-bodied men and women are being turned away because they are homosexual, this is where the choosing has clearly crossed the line.
I have always wondered about LGBT issues in the army. I am glad that I read this article to learn about these issues that are a reality for almost 65,000 people in the army. To begin with, I am very shocked that Darren Manzella was investigated for being gay. I feel that this is a personal issue and that no one in the army should be investigated for being gay.
The Don’t Ask Don’t Tell issue is a very serious one in the army. I feel that this policy should not be abandoned if it means that it will allow individuals in the army to feel more comfortable about being gay or lesbian in the army. However, if it just promotes not talking about the issue and avoiding the topic I feel that it should be abandoned. However, I certainly feel that it is absurd being it is saying that you should only defend our country if you keep your sexual orientation a secret. I feel that our society has gotten to the point that we can talk about this. Thus, I certainly feel that this policy should be abandoned.
I am glad that Darren was able to come out about being gay in the army. However, I would have never thought that he was gay. I am very surprised that he came about being gay after being in the army. Moreover, I feel that him being gay would in no way at all weaken morale. A solider always knows what his long term goal is, fighting for his or her country. Thus, it would be the same as two individuals being in a relationship of the same sex. I feel that if this would happen in the army it would be less of a controversy. Thus, I feel that if a male were homosexual in the army he would still have his goal in mind. Men in the army are trained to be strong and determined and I feel that not many would not let this come in the way fulfilling his duty. After all, why would a man come in to the army to risk his life and not fulfill his duty.
This article has opened my eyes that gay soldiers are no less qualified to represent and fight for our country. It does not matter on your sexual orientation because in the end you would be able to fulfill any duty that you truly wanted despite your personal feelings.
Moreover, Menzella was clearly gay for a long time and this never seemed to hinder his performance before hand. However, individuals just made a big issue out of this after they knew. If they had no idea no controversy would have been made. Thus, I feel that this is just pure hypocrisy in society’s part.
I think the “Don’t ask don’t tell” policy is a pathetic excuse to prevent gays and lesbians from being in the military. I don’t understand why it is even a law. Why are people allowed to be open about their heterosexual relationships in the military but if a homosexual person discusses their homosexuality openly they are more than likely to be given an honorable discharge? The original reasoning behind it, that it “weakens morale” is the most disgusting reasoning behind any law I’ve ever heard. How could the fact that someone is openly homosexual weaken a group of soldier’s morale? How could you join the military and not be comfortable around a gay or lesbian person when you fight and kill people for a living? How does that make any sense? I feel like if you join the military to fight for our country, which is supposed to be the land of the free, than you should be completely comfortable with people of every race, religion, and sexual orientation. I personally just do not understand why the world as a whole is unable to accept homosexuality. There are laws against being openly gay. It is the 21st century, there should not be laws against anyone or anything that makes up a persons being. That makes me sick. Especially when these laws are directed at our military. The only people suitable for the US military used to be white males. However, slowly but surely, women and people of color were able to join and fight in the military. So technically the military cannot deny gay or lesbian people the right to join the military, but they just can’t tell anyone. I just don’t understand this at all. Are they allowed to be openly gay when they aren’t in combat? Or do they have to remain in the closet the entire time they are enlisted, while at home or while deployed? I agree with Darren Manzella in that your continuity in the military should depend on your performance and rank, not your sexual orientation. I find it ridiculous that he was kicked out for the sole reason of being gay. Especially since he was openly gay in the military for over a year and was then kicked out. That is what bothers me the most about this story. I think the military had no right to give him an honorable discharge for “homosexual conduct.” It would be one thing if he were raping or doing whatever to other men in his unit, but he wasn’t. He openly talked about being a homosexual in the military and he was discharged for that. I think that is a disgrace and it is really a horrible but true reflection of our government.
This whole issue of don’t ask don’t tell to me is a huge failure of the government of the alleged most free and great country in the world. How we can claim to have freedom of speech, religion, and everything else, yet now allow people defending our country to be who they want seems absolutely ridiculous to me. We pride ourselves on everything that the US stands for; yet don’t let the people who defend it to have those same rights. In the case of Darren, this is especially true. He clearly does not look or seem to have any of the qualities that we would associate with a person who is gay, yet he is and proud of it. Because of this, he could easily just not have said anything and passed through his time in the military with nobody knowing, but this is beside the point. The point is that it should matter whether he is gay or not, because he was doing a brave thing for this country, a country who right now does not accept simply the kind of person that he is. Now I am not naïve enough to believe that everyone is as tolerant and understanding as I think that I am, and that they might not necessarily be comfortable with fighting with someone who is “different.” But let’s be honest, if someone is willing to stick their neck out for their country, why wouldn’t you be comfortable with them? The answer is because no matter how much evidence that people can find about how it doesn’t affect anything, and that it shouldn’t matter whether or not someone is gay; people are and will continue to be close-minded. The fact that someone is gay, to some people, makes them someone who doesn’t belong, or that the person is going to make some advance to turn them gay. As long as don’t ask don’t tell exists, it makes it ok for soldiers in the army to have a problem with gay soldiers, as they can claim that is not something that is accepted by the army and the country in general. If there was a policy that would openly allow and even encourage gay soldiers to come out, then other soldiers would not be able to even say anything or able to claim that is something that is wrong or that they don’t want around. That open policy would make every soldier in the army more comfortable and open for everyone, and allow them to better serve and defend our country. I know that personally I want the best people to defend me and my country, and it does not matter if they are gay, straight, white, black, or purple, as long as they are the best person for the job.
That video clip is pretty amazing. Sam is right if I saw that guy anywhere in the public I would have definitely not seen him as a gay man. His story is actually pretty interesting in that he found somewhat of a loop hole though the Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell rule and was able to fight in Iraq with no problems from his comrades or superiors. When he said there are 65,000 homosexuals in the United States Army that really struck me as a large number. I think if you are placed in a situation in where you life depends on the life of you team—being gay, a woman, a black man, a Latino man, a Asian, or another man disappears and all that goes through you mind is, “watch my back and I will watch yours.” Its interesting how we have to bring people to closer to death in order to have them become more open and accepting of other people, etc. When you are in Iraq, you have to make it through and the only way is to trust and believe in the other people of the army. That guy seemed like a good solider, followed orders, complete successful missions, and helped defend the united states of America- all while being gay. What this video depicted to me was my stereotypical perspective of gay men being more femine and talking with a lisp, etc. This video totally disproved that, this guy was in war, carried a gun around, talked normal, probably killed people, etc. One important quote I found in the video clip that really seemed to hit it home for everyone of color and who are LGBT is that he said, life is too short don’t misunderstand who you are. I think that is the right message; if you are a black man, don’t be afraid to be a black man. It comes to the question of identity, and how it is crucial to who we are mentally and obvisouly physically. This guy got to see all pretty quickly, he was sent to bowels of hell, discovered or maybe even accepted his identity and now lives life more fulfilled in that he is comfortable with who he is. Maybe what we need to clean up racism and discriminations against the LGBT is to have a big war against something or somebody where we are placed in a situation where we not only have to trust and accept who we are- but trust and accept who we are with. Because if we don’t the guy next to you can die, and that would be on your conscious but more importantly you would die, no doubt. To get in such a fragile state of survival and too bring the real things that matter in life like surviving stereotypes, racists thoughts, ect disappear and all you left with is the people next to you who want to make out alive just as much as you do- and the only way to do that is to work together.
Overall, I think the policy just needs to be thrown out. It’s outdated and simply irrelevant to the military as a whole. I feel like it doesn’t serve any purpose, and I don’t understand how any good is supposed to come from it. The study Sam mentioned said that having LGBT would not weaken the morale of soldiers on a unit. If the soldiers themselves don’t mind, then why on earth would we have DADT altogether? In my opinion, the Don’t Ask Don’t Tell policy is among the most ridiculous policies that we have in the US. We lost 13,000 perfectly good, able-bodied soldiers for no good reason due to this policy. THIRTEEN THOUSAND!!! We pretend that we are a forward-thinking country, yet we instate policies that prohibit people from discussing their sexual orientations. Actually I take that statement back because it isn’t even true. You can be as graphic and perverse as you want if you are straight, but if you are LGBT then you are forced to keep an entire aspect of your life in complete secrecy or face the possibility of being discharged.
We’ve all had a significant other who we have fallen in love with and know how hard it is not to talk about that person all the time. Imagine not being able to mention that person at all when you are away from all of your friends and family and most likely pretty lonely. Our relationships are a large part of who we are as people and to be forced to conceal such a huge part of our being would probably be very unsettling.
I don’t understand how in every other workplace LGBT are protected, but in the military, of all places, they are discriminated against. Isn’t the military supposed to be setting an example for the rest of society and taking a lead in promoting tolerance? Shouldn’t the military be the most open to accepting good, qualified citizens willing to fight for our country? To turn away trained soldiers merely because of their sexual orientation baffles me. Lawsuits are filed everyday about LGBT being treated unfairly in the workplace, but somehow the military gets a pass? It just simply doesn’t add up.
If Darren Manzela was a good soldier before he was open about his sexuality, after he got that secret off of his chest and didn’t have to carry the burden of hiding it all day every day, wouldn’t he be an even better soldier? Anyone who sees the video and claims that they could tell that Darren is a member of LGBT before he stated it himself is a liar. There is no way to tell someone’s sexual orientation just by looking at him or interacting with him a couple times. Some people may seem a certain way, but you never really know until that person chooses to share that information with you. You can never truly judge a book by its cover, no matter how well you think you can.
The idea that some people are against gays and lesbians in the military, defending our country, is just beyond me. How could they possibly have something against a patriot? Regardless of someone’s sexual orientation, if they want to fight for their country then other people should not try to impede them. Even the higher ups in the military say that gays and lesbians serving should be considered a non-issue. If the highest ranked generals got together and decided on this, than some homophobe back here in the homeland really cannot say anything against it. Who are they to speak against anyone in the military? Also, I believe that other soldiers in the military are not negatively affected by having someone that is gay or lesbian in their company, troop, whatever. Everyone who joins the military receives the same training. If gays and lesbians get through the same training as everyone else then it should not matter at all. It cannot possibly hurt the morale to have somebody who has met the same requirements as everyone else to be in the military. The guy who was discharged for being gay is just outright garbage. From what I have drawn from the video and text is that Darren Manzella coming out actually boosted the morale of the unit. The fact that he was more honest with them actually brought them closer together and they developed a better relationship with him. It is an example that everyone from our country, no matter what their differences are can still come together and help defend our country. The Army has discharged a lot of people for coming out and a lot of them were at specialized skilled positions. Due to the fact that they let these soldiers go they actually lost a lot of money because they had to train so many replacements for them. The entire “Don’t ask, don’t tell” policy of the United States Army should just be done away with. It does not matter if someone is homosexual or not, if they want to do their part in the military then they should not be prevented in doing so. This policy forces people to hide who they really are, if they are in fact gay or lesbian. These honorable people should not have to hide their identities or true selves. They have enough to deal with just being overseas and fighting anyway. I have no problem with anyone who decides to join the military regardless of whether or not they are straight. For all of the people who are fighting in the United States Army, a great deal of respect is owed to them by every citizen, especially those who did not join the Army themselves. I mean, come on.
Reading the blog entry titled, “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell..Please,” and watching the accompanying video, I realized how official the “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell,” rule is in the military. I always thought it was an unwritten rule of the military where if a person was gay, it was just better for them to keep it to themselves just to avoid the chance of being persecuted by their peers or superiors. This blog entry, however, made it seem like a person in the military can actually be discharged from service for being honest and coming out as a gay person. To me, it is a shame that when a person in the military becomes honest with him or herself and comes out of the closet, they run the risk of being kicked out of the military. From the blog entry, Darren Manzella served multiple tours of duty in Iraq, but that was not enough to save him from getting discharged when we went public with his homosexuality.
Sam poses a very good question in this blog entry. He asks, “would you ever think that Darren Manzella is gay?” More often than not, people think they can tell very easily whether someone is a homosexual. Myself included, people enlist several stereotypes to determine whether specific individuals are gay or not. But by reading this blog entry and watching the video, it seems like it might not as easy as we think to “know” whether someone is gay. Darren Manzella seems like any other person, heterosexual or homosexual. I am beginning to realize that many people, who I never even considered to be gay, probably are. This relates back to the statement Sam made in class one day when he said many of us probably have gay parents and we do not even know it. It is not so easy to know whether someone is gay or not, and it is time for many of us to get rid of the stereotypes that we have in our minds.
Being a LGBT soldier in the military should not be an issue anymore. It is 2009 and the military needs to get with the times. LGBT discrimination is becoming a thing of the past, but for some reason the military still feels the need to discharge people if they are out in the open and admit they are gay outright. It is not right. Soldiers are soldiers. It does not matter if they are gay, straight, black, white, male, female, they are all fighting for this country and should be treated honorably. In no way does having gay troops weaken the morale of the military. It is a shame that the military is still employing these old-fashioned tactics.
I have always felt that the army’s “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy is absolutely ridiculous. Even more ridiculous than this is that Darren Manzella was “honorably discharged” because of an admittance to his homosexuality. Why is it ok for someone who is in the military who is straight to proclaim their so called “straight-ness” while someone who comes and says their gay has to be discharged from the army? These people are willingly fighting for our country to better our own lives. What right do we have to kick them out of a path that they have chosen- even though they do not receive equal rights and are definitely treated unfairly? There can be no greater injustice than when the country you are proudly fighting for you does not give you the respect that you deserve. Darren Manzella has every right to live the life he loves. The army has no right to take this away from him. We are fighting a war in Iraq and Afghanistan in order to give the people there the freedom that we think that they deserve, but we can’t even follow the same path in our own country with the armed forces that are fighting this battle. I have tremendous respect for the troops whether I agree with the war or not, and no one who is fighting for our country in this manner should be treated in this fashion. His homosexuality is surely not getting in the way of his duties as military personnel so why should it be a factor at all?
I was not able to tell just by looking at Darren Manzella that he was gay or even by the way he spoke. But then again I don’t really believe that you can tell a person’s sexual orientation just by looking at them. I think that when a person is completely open about their sexuality is the only time a person can really figure out what they are. That doesn’t mean exhibiting the characteristics that we associate with homosexuality or heterosexuality but being open about the people or person that they love. There are probably so many people like Darren Manzella who are hiding this aspect of their personal life for fear of being discharged from a job that they might love. There is no way that we can call ourselves a free country when we don’t allow people to marry the ones they love. Why can a man and a woman legitimize their love through marriage but a man and a man or a woman and a woman cannot do the same? We definitely live under false pretenses or we put up a front for the rest of the world. We need to sit down and examine the guidelines of freedom before we declare that we are “free” country.
I found this video, and the whole topic of LGBTS in the military for that matter, very interesting. We talked somewhat in depth about this is in my recitation, and I found the conversation quite enthralling. It is my personal opinion that a person’s sexual orientation should have no effect whatsoever on them being allowed to defend our country. The only qualification to enter the army should be a person’s ability to perform as a soldier. A given person’s race, gender, ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc. should not even come into consideration of them being allowed to be in the military unless it will in any way inhibit their performance. As trends from the past show, the Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell will likely eventually be dropped. The numbers of people wanting to be in the military are declining, so when we need more troops we will quickly forget about what kind of people the potential recruits will be attracted to. For example, we can look back to the Civil War to see a similar trend implement itself. While slavery was one of the resounding issue that caused the Civil War in the first place, neither side allowed black people to fight in their army. As the war waged on, and attrition became an increasingly important factor in who would win, both the North and South’s policies changed. I am a little shaky with exactly what happened, but as far as I remember the North allowed freed blacks and any escaped slaves to fight in their army. This ultimately proved to be extremely helpful, because the North had a new untapped system of manpower, and the black soldiers really had the most motivation to be fighting. I am sure that as our involvement in Iraq continues, and as we begin to deploy more troops to Afghanistan, we will eventually reach to the LGBT community to recruit more soldiers when it becomes necessary.
Perhaps more pertinent to this blog from Sam, I personally would have an extremely tough time figuring out that Darren Manzella is gay. I do not pride myself in being able to point a homosexual person, but with some people it is blatantly obvious. For the people that fall into this category, I would imagine that they purposely do so because they are proud of their sexual orientation and want every to know just that. I think that as more and more people continue to admit their homosexuality, it has become increasingly harder to identify gay people. If I didn’t hear some of my best friends telling me stories about their sexual encounters with girls, for all I know they could be gay. In today’s world, it is nearly impossible to identify someone that is homosexual without them being extremely flamboyant about it. And even so, there is a new metro-sexual culture emerging, making the distinction even more difficult.
Anyone should be able to fight in the army, regardless of his or her sexual orientation. If they have enough “balls” to be willing to give their life to serve our country when should their sexual orientation stop them? They will have to go through the same training as everyone else, regardless if they are gay, straight, male or female. They all have to do the same thing. I honestly think it is a slap in the face if we tell should that is willing to serve to country but deny them. Being gay isn’t a disease or a disadvantage, but for some reason the army seems to treat it that way. That is total bullshit and it is one of the things I think we need to change. We are all taught that everyone is equal and should be treated equal. I know that the army is a superior group of people that are all well trained and prepared to go to war but if we all start out equal then why is it that the army can say gay people, or should I say openly gay people, aren’t welcome.
I bet that anyone that looks at Sgt. Manzella couldn’t tell that he is gay. If I would look at him I would probably guess he is straight and if I found out he was in the army I would think that he is a “badass”. He has enough courage to go into the army and to make two tours. But the thing that shows he has the most courage, or at least I my opinion, is that he openly came out a being homosexual to the army. His decision actually has the adverse effect as the army though gay people would have in their unit. For some reason the army thinks that this would drive the morale down, instead it actually boosted it. This was because they felt more comfortable with it. Yes, more comfortable knowing that someone is his or her unit was homosexual. The more you know about someone and the more honest they can be, the more comfortable you are with them and the more you can trust them. Trust is probably the most important thing in a unit. You have to trust the people around that they cant handle themselves and help you if you need help.
In my opinion the way the army runs this whole “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy is old and outdated. It should either be eliminated or worked out a different way such as there should be no homosexual activity inside the army. By that I mean no man love affairs but its ok for people to be gay.
The LGBT community has been fighting this battle for some time now. But things just don’t change over night. Especially not in the military! The “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy is just a legal way for the military to be homophobic. The LGBT community has come a long way; but unfortunately they still have a long fight ahead of them.
American has shown time and time again that it will not give any minority group an easy time, when it comes to the full rights and privileges that every citizen was promised. Nothing will be given to you in this country, unless you’re a white man! Any and every women, black person, immigrant or member of the LGBT community will testify to that. Every right that a minority group has been given, someone had to fight, march or boycott for, nothing was given.
Thing do change, and I do believe that one day (I don’t know if that day will be anytime soon) things will change in the military, but it takes time. The Native American’s have been fighting longer than any group, and they still have gotten the respect they deserve. The Blacks have been fighting for hundreds of years, and we just started making progress in the 1960’s with Martin. Women have been fighting since the beginning of time, the Women’s Right Movement started in the 1920’s. And yes progress has been made, but there are still some employers who pay their men more than women for the same job. We all had to struggle. And I know the LGBT community have been fighting sense the begin of time as well, but this country has just start addressing the LGBT issues, so things will take time to really take effect, and for somebody to actually start making some significant changes. And thanks to the LGBT leaders, the issues are now on the table. 320
As a black woman I understand the struggles of the LGBT community, and I truly believe that they deserve every single right that everyone else has. And I honestly don’t know why many other minorities do not sympathize with their fight. In the words of Dr. Martin Luther King, “an injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere.” And there are some true injustices going on when it comes to the LGBT community.
But back to the military issue, the idea that gay soldier weaken moral, is absolutely ridiculous, on all levels. All just excuses to be homophobic, the military just can’t help themselves. As far as they are concern the soldiers could be gay, lead gay lives, all just as long as no one knows about it. But it’s 2009, we have a black person, many many women are leading in all fields from government to big business, and the LGBT community too shall have their rising moment. And I personally will be right there to support them in their fight, just as so many have supported my people in ours.
I am honestly appalled at the conduct of the military after viewing the story about Darren Manzella. The question I have in regards to his situation is how can the military (of all groups in the United States) out rightly discriminate in that way? How can an organization that is a direct representation of our country both here and abroad allow such prejudice to exist and thrive among men and women who are willing to lay down their lives for our freedom?
I could go on and on with question after question I have in response to Mr. Manzella’s predicament, but I will try and limit them to how can we make a change so this doesn’t happen again. I have always heard about the Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell Policy within military but to be honest, never took it seriously until viewing this story. Not that I didn’t believe it existed but just that I never truly thought deeply about what kind of impact it had on military personnel. There have got to be thousands of members in a silent struggle between their sexual orientation and risking their job and livelihood.
In a day and age where being openly homosexual isn’t universally accepted but more common than in any past generation, we need to re-examine our personal views on a growing phenomenon. Along with that we need to reconsider how our military treats those who are courageous enough to what most are not.
Whoever came up with the excuse that having openly gay members “weakens morale” was doing some serious fishing for a plausible excuse to not have to deal with the issue. Anyone with half a brain can deduce that this was the military’s way of justifying their own discrimination of those who are considered too different to be accepted. This also came about in the past when organizations like the LGBTA were far from prominent and it was unheard of to be openly gay and have that be ok.
So it was no surprise that recent studies have shown that having gay members in the midst of straight members does nothing to alter morale, and Darren Manzella is prime example of that. He successfully served in combat alongside his comrades and fulfilled his military duty to the best of his ability. His sexual orientation did not interfere in any way with his determination to defend his country and support his fellow military members.
The bottom line is that there are living examples of gay military men and women that can disprove the assumed consequences of allowing them to be open about their lifestyles. Change needs to happen and it needs to happen soon because discrimination within our military should not be tolerated in any capacity.
The don’t ask, don’t tell policy should be abolished. I don’t see many people running to the front lines to fight in this war, so why should we stop the ones that want to? I’m actually surprised that gay people still want to join the armed forces after we’ve continually denied them the basic right of marriage, and despite the continued homophobia that is running rampant in our country. I have never been in the armed forces, and I never plan to be, so I don’t understand the bond that forms between people in the armed forces, but I’ve been told that it becomes your family. This is something I can relate to. I know that nothing could ever make me love a member of my family any less, gay, straight, serial killer, puppy kicker, it doesn’t matter. My family is my family. After going through training and eventually fighting alongside the people in your troop, seeing them die right next to you, I can’t imagine that people actually care whether others are gay. Don’t they have more important things to worry about? While I don’t doubt that being openly gay in the army could cause an increase in hate crimes, there is no way to end homophobia in the army unless people are confronted with it. And aren’t the armed forces supposed to be the bearers of all American ideals? They bring democracy, and freedom, and charge in to “barbaric” countries with flags flying. Isn’t acceptance part of America? Aren’t we the big melting pot? America was the place where the streets were paved with gold, where anyone could make it, does this not include gay people? Don’t ask, don’t tell is an outdated and offensive policy. If men can have up pictures of their girlfriends, shouldn’t men be able to have pictures of their boyfriends, and likewise for women. I don’t understand what people are scared of. Do they think that by letting people be out in the military they’re going to turn everyone else gay? Homosexuality is genetic, just like you can’t catch brown hair, you can’t catch homosexuality. Do they think the gay people will just be trying to have sex with everyone all the time? Whenever people say this to me, I give them the same response, are you attracted to every single person you see? Obviously not, so why would gay people be attracted to every person they see? It makes no sense. There is absolutely no reason for gay people to be silenced in the armed forces, or in life. If you want to go fight in a war we shouldn’t be in, knock yourself out, because I know I would be the first one crossing the border if there was a draft.
I think don’t ask don’t tell is wrong and is not fair to those that are gay working in the military. I believe people should be free to express how they feel even if that is with someone of the same sex. Being in the army I’m sure the soldiers look for their family and their soul mate to help them make the situation better even if that is with video or with letter. If they are not allowed to publicity show their love then that could make a situation worst for those involved. I don’t understand what the big problem is.
This man in the video has been in the military for years and none of his friends sensed that he was a gay man nor did he try to make a move on any of them to make them feel uncomfortable. When I see being not liking gay people I don’t get it. It makes me think that some people need to look at their selves and ask are they go and if not why should it matter. Being in the army is bad enough as it is and the aftereffects that it has on the soldiers are deadly and for the army officials to deny soldiers their right to be happy is not right and needs to be change.
I don’t know why the army would deny a person that wants to fight for their country. Doing research there are not a lot of people that think this way and would give their life for the success of the United States so I think the army should consider everyone that is brave enough to join the army. This is not fair. This man doesn’t look gay nor does he act gay so I don’t understand what the big deal is.
Oh no I’m working with a gay man he’s going to feel on my butt while he tries to save my life in a battle. I don’t understand how you could think that way. To be truthful most gay gays are some of the shallow people that I know and I know they would not just go after any man just because they are there they could care less but for them not to be treated equality is not fair and needs to change. You love who you love you can’t change that as much as you would like to you can’t. So I think more people need to be open-minded and stop trying to be mean to people because of what they may like.
After watching this video I was in total shock. I find the whole idea of the “don’t ask don’t tell” policy to be very disturbing. Honestly, what does a person’s sexual orientation have to do with their dedication to their country by wanting to serve and protect? I feel that it totally contradicts everything that America stands for and believes. The idea that everyone is entitled to be and believe whatever they feel is right. The argument is that it weakens the “morale” but I feel what weakens morale would be people having to hide who they really are inside. That concept does not make any sense to me at all. I am not fully educated on the history of this concept but whomever or however it came about should really be evaluated. This could be why a lot of people are hesitant to join the army, in fear that if who they really are gets out they could be rejected. The fact that there is a rule or policy that forbids people from being open about their sexual orientation leads me to further believe that there are other shady acts going on behind closed doors. I believe that people are people and that it should not matter if they are heterosexual or homosexual, the right to serve their country should not be in jeopardy because of who they are. In my opinion that is like saying a person is not allowed to serve their country because they have green eyes; it’s just plain ridiculous. The story of Darren in the CNN video was truly a sad story. Here was a man that struggled with his identity, and when he finally came into who he was and realized what made him happy in life was being with another man and not a woman, he was rejected. He has every right to be in a relationship with whoever he pleases. This totally is not what America prides itself on being about. It should not matter the person’s race, gender, religion, sexual orientation, etc. Homosexuals have been fighting for their rights in this country for quite some time. Homosexuals in the past few years have gained the right to marry in some states and to also have a family by adopting children as well. So why it that they still are not allowed to be open about who they are when it comes to serving their country? I do believe that in the near future that this idea of “don’t as don’t tell,” will soon be a thing of the past. The more this situation begins to surface itself, and more people are aware of this issue it will eventually be abolished. The majorities of Americans have homosexual friends and loved ones and this will really make them unhappy. There will still be a lot of Americans who will still be against it, but I feel that the majority will rule.
Being in the military and in units where there were homosexuals I do understand both sides of the argument. On the one hand I can see how a lot of soldiers could and would be worried or disturbed by having a LGBT fighting next to you. I think that a lot of this is because of the stigma surrounding the homosexual community being that a gay man will be more feminine and not willing to stand and fight when called to do so. I am not saying that this is true but it is a common belief among soldiers. There are a lot of homophobic people in the military especially in combat arms units. Some of the most common jokes in a lot of units are gay jokes. There seems to always be someone being accused of being homosexual and even though this is mostly done in jest I think it adds to the stigma of gays in the military. If someone can’t complete a task they are automatically called gay. All this does is add to homophobic tendencies and makes it more acceptable to be homophobic in the military. For a lot of new soldiers if your superiors are acting in such a manner the tendencies will be to try to fall in line so that you are not ostracized. On the other side of the argument there is no justification for the fears. I have served with individuals that were both openly homosexual and not. One that was came out to our platoon after he had been in for a while and we had already made our judgments about him based on his character not his sexual preference so I think that was an easier transition for him and the platoon, everybody already had an opinion of him and not much changed he was a good soldier and we all trusted him and knew him so there wasn’t much of a problem. This was kept within the platoon due to the fact that nobody really knew how it would be handled by our superiors. Nobody wanted anything negative to happen to him so it was kept internal. I feel that the regulations regarding LGBT soldiers are outdated but there is still a concern from a lot of other members of the military about what would happen if persons that were openly gay were allowed in the military but alot of this could just be homophobia. I don’t think that any of this will change for a while at least until there is a change in the general consensus of homosexuals from the members of the armed forces. The reason that I don’t believe that there will be a change in the near future is that a lot of service members are very conservative and just plain don’t agree with homosexuality.
The don’t ask don’t tell policy is, to me, is a double edged sword. On one side, yes it is immoral and unjust to prohibit a person from sharing who they really are, especially if they are willing to put their life on the line. However, on the other side, there are some people that are uncomfortable with homosexuality and with quarters being so close there, it is understandable to see why this policy is in place. I neither condone nor condemn this policy, and I know many will say that I am just being evasive; however, it is not my place to tell anyone what they can and cannot do. These service men sign-up on their own free will and they all sign the same contract with stipulations such as this one.
I do think this video will open peoples’ eyes to the reality of homosexuals in the military. Hopefully, those who have stereotyped the homosexual community can see that qualifications for a soldier do not lie between their legs and that their sexual preference has no bearing on how they defend the country they hold so dear to their hearts.
Some people have made the point that we live in a world where acceptance of differences is becoming a part of our national identity. Yet, we still live in a world where homosexual are prosecuted every day for their sexual orientation. Yes, we as a country are changing, but this type of change does not happen all at once and I feel that this policy insures the safety for homosexuals against those people who have a problem with accepting these types of differences. I do hope and believe that one day the ignorance of the world will go away but until that day comes, we have to try to understand the other side.
(This is the end of my comment, it would not let me post it altogether because it was too long)
I have mixed feelings about the "don't ask dont tell" policy. I think in some ways it is there to protect the soldiers and they should not be forced to "come out" if they don't want to or are not ready yet. Some of them may not even know if they are gay. However, I do not think its fair that if someone in the military is LGBT and they are revealed or spoke openly about it, that they are asked to leave or have to step down. So what if they are gay? It is not illegal for men and women to have a relationship within the military. I think that unless there are complaints about being uncomfortable around that soldier and can have proof that its becoming a problem, there should not be an issue about being gay.
Whether you are gay or not, you are still a brother to everyone in the military with you. A straight man would not not protect his fellow soldier and brother becasue he is gay just like a gay man would not not protect a straight man. The bottom line is these men and women are brothers and sisters in the military and have a common goal to protect. We need to look past sexuality, just like we looked past skin color, and realize the big picture. These people are going out and risking their lives for millions of people they will never meet, people that might hate gays. Think about that. A gay man or woman is fighting for you to ensure you have a protected environment and you are going to judge them and hate them because he likes another man?
After watching this video, I have even more respect for LGBT soliders. Listen to that word, soldier. They are protecting our country and are fighting to protect our freedom and everything this country stands for. It does not make sense to me how we can allow these soldiers to go out and risk their lives to protect us and our constitution and fight for our laws while our laws do not allow them to openly be gay or get married. Our laws say that everyone is equal and there is no discrimination allowed. Bullshit. We are discrimintating be having this policy. Gays are the same as everyone else. I know the bible says that marriage is sacred and it must be between a man and a woman but our country was not founded on the bible. It was founded by real people who wanted to have a great country. I think that it is stupid for laws to be dictated by the bible. Not everyone is religious. The bible says that God is forgiving so why not "forgive" the LGBT's for their "sins."
I personally think that the "Don't Ask the Tell Policy" should abandoned. I am in the Army Reserves and i recently served a tour in Iraq. I knew a gay guy in my unit. Everyone knew he was gay as well. Him being gay and pretty much being open about it had no effect on the unit or on his performance on duty. I feel being secretive about it is worse than being open. Being gay is becoming more accepted in today's world and as feel as though it should be accepted in the military as well. If people were more comfortable in their own sexuality, there would not have to be policies like these. I feel like discharging someone with such qualifications as Darren Manzella is not good strategically.
Here is a Iraqi veteran with years of experience and he is discharged from the Army because of his sexual orientation. The policy was a great way to keep the peace years ago between military soldiers and their gay counterparts. However, times have changed, people's thinking have changed, and so should the policy. It is ashame that someone like Darren Manzella is discriminated against because of his sexual orientation. This is an Iraqi veteran; someone who should be honored. Someone who should be looked upon as a role model.
Don’t ask, Don’t tell is the biggest hypocrisy in the U.S. Military. This is a policy that discriminates homosexuals. At this moment we are fighting a 2 fronted war. We need all the bodies to fill boots on the ground that we can get. This is not the time to be discriminating against people due to their sexuality. This is a time to reinforce and maintain as many troops as we could possibly get. Let’s face it, another big conflict could break out at any minute, and we would need everyone in the service to contribute.
Don’t ask, Don’t tell is the biggest hypocrisy in the U.S. Military. This is a policy that discriminates homosexuals. At this moment we are fighting a 2 fronted war. We need all the bodies to fill boots on the ground that we can get. This is not the time to be discriminating against people due to their sexuality. This is a time to reinforce and maintain as many troops as we could possibly get. Let’s face it, another big conflict could break out at any minute, and we would need everyone in the service to contribute. I am a Veteran and I served a tour in Iraq’s Al Anbar Province. I can tell you that the last thing anyone is thinking about there is whether someone is gay or not. I don’t know what the military’s command and our worthless politicians are thinking. Let me put it to you this way; I would never worry about whether or not the guy behind me, no pun intended, has my ass covered, or wants to “cover” my ass. I don’t think that way, nor will I ever, but there are those hardcore conservative assholes, that fill the high ranks in this circus of a military that are homophobic.
My post continued:
I think they truly believe that gays will infect our entire military. That’s not true. In fact there are homosexuals out there that can probably carry out their duty better than some straight guys. It’s sad when you think about it. And this isn’t the first time something like this has happened. In past wars, such as WWII, Blacks were not allowed into certain MOS’s in the US armed forces. And if they were, it was a segregated unit, with white leadership. So, our commanders eventually desegregated the military, but instead focused on the gays. What is a gay person in the military possibly going to do that bad.
My post continued:
About one year ago I heard a report on a survey that was conducted on pure anonymity in the service. It concluded that there were over 50,000 homosexual service members currently serving. I wish I could find the source, it was really interesting. Now the biggest eye opener was the fact that a lot of those 50,000 were commissioned officers, high ranking people. The people that make command decisions on the battlefield. Pilots, surgeons, company commanders, and so on, are gay and serving. Now 50,000, have not admitted, but threatened that if action was not taken in the near future to abolish this policy, they would consider a mass coming out. Then our nation’s military would be fucked.
Try replacing 50,000 bodies overnight, not happening. I think they should stand up and do it. They need to light a fire under our nation’s leader’s asses, and get them moving into abolishing this policy. The military has gotten out of hand with its policies. They say enlist, but only those that aren’t fags don’t have tattoos, don’t have piercings, don’t have criminal records, and don’t smoke dope. Listen, this is bullshit, beggars can’t be choosers. I’m all for gays in the military. Good luck to all of them, I hope it works out.
Sorry about the multiple posts, this thing doesn't allow big cut and paste jobs from word.
After watching this clip I realized something. I realized just how ridiculous our country can be. Of course I have heard of the Don’t Ask Don’t Tell policy, and I have always been somewhat outraged by it. But at the same time I never really did see why it would be so hard to keep one’s private life to them while at work. I mean that’s what being a soldier is, it’s a job, an occupation. I realized though, that while most people have a 9 to 5 job working in a cozy office, these soldiers are risking their lives across seas for us. Their jobs aren’t 9 to 5, they don’t get to clock out whenever they feel sick. They are on the job 24/7, and therefore their private lives will eventually conflict with that of their jobs.
Now as a gay man myself, I do think that this policy is beyond prejudiced. For someone to say, don’t be yourself, even though you’re going into a alley where you can possibly ambushed by a bunch of terrorists with guns. It makes utterly no sense whatsoever. The mere fact that the government is wasting our tax money and their resources to investigate the sexual orientation of a soldier who is fighting for their country, alone, is not only ridiculous but also stupid and unimaginable. Most homosexuals in the army are most likely stressed enough as it is knowing that they could die at any moment, but to also have to spend precious thought on hiding something that they have no control is not only harmful to that particular soldier but to his platoon mates who are counting on them to have their backs.
We’re in a war, let’s face it, a war that a good portion of our country does not want us to be in. If someone, who happens to be gay, wants to fight for us, and potentially die for us, who are we to tell them they can’t because they were born liking the same sex. The army needs to get off their high horse and realize that in today’s day and age, they can’t control everything. They need to utilize what they have instead of making them leave.
After watching this clip I realized something. I realized just how ridiculous our country can be. Of course I have heard of the Don’t Ask Don’t Tell policy, and I have always been somewhat outraged by it. But at the same time I never really did see why it would be so hard to keep one’s private life to them while at work. I mean that’s what being a soldier is, it’s a job, an occupation. I realized though, that while most people have a 9 to 5 job working in a cozy office, these soldiers are risking their lives across seas for us. Their jobs aren’t 9 to 5, they don’t get to clock out whenever they feel sick. They are on the job 24/7, and therefore their private lives will eventually conflict with that of their jobs.